ICE Box

[Sondia Luong 1C]

Hey guys, do we generally only use ice box for finding the concentration of weak acid and weak bases? Or would it be a good idea to always use ice box regardless of the strength of the acid when working through a problem?

[Earl Garrovillo 2L]

I'd say unless you know for sure that you're working with a strong acid/base (i.e. stated in the problem) to just use the ICE box. It'd be a lot more efficient to only use the OH-/H3O+ concentrations when you know you're working with strong acids/bases but if you're unsure, using the ICE box would be a safe way to know you're doing things right.

[Valerie Doan 3I]

Usually, the ICE box method is only used for weak acids and bases because they don't fully dissociate in water. However, strong acids and bases do completely ionize so we can just directly use the pH, Ka, or Kb formula without having to do an ICE box.

[connie ma 3G]

we use the ice chart for weak acids/bases to better visualize the changes that are occurring in solution. strong acids/bases dissociate 100% which makes the calculations very simple so we dont need the ice charts. you can definitely still use the ice chart for strong acids/bases if you want to but i dont imagine it will be as helpful and will only take longer.

[Andersen Chu 2H]

You shouldnt really need to set up an ice box for strong acids/bases because the concentration of the strong acid/base should be a 1:1 ratio with the concentration of hydronium/hydroxide

[Rob Tsai 2F]

I think usually with strong acids/bases you don't NEED to make an ICE box, but I don't know if the question will necessarily tell you if the acid/base is strong or not. Just for simplicity's sake, I would probably just make one every time!

[Inderpal Singh 2L]

You usually wouldn't need to use an ICE box for strong acids/bases. However, I believe that there is no harm in doing so.

[Anastasia Yulo 1C]

Hey! The ICE box is only used for weak acids and bases.This is because they don't fully dissociate in water.
Strong acids and bases, on the other hand, completely ionize. Thus, we can just use the pH, Ka, or Kb formula. With strong acids and bases an ICE box is not necessary given their behavior.

[Emma_Barrall_3J]

Because strong acids and bases fully dissociate, the ICE box method should only be used for weak acids and bases as they partially dissociate. :)

[Devin Patel 2D]

If you know for certain that you're working with strong acids and strong bases, you don't necessarily need the ICE box because they fully disassociate. So I would use an ICE box for weak acids and bases because they only partially disassociate and it would also help visualize those calculations better as they are not as simple as calculations involving strong acids and strong bases.

[Karl Yost 1L]

Yeah, only use ICE boxes for weak acids/bases, as strong acids/bases fully dissociate — so we assume that the initial concentration of acid/base is equal to the concentration of [H3O+] and [OH-], respectively (assuming 1:1 stoichiometry in the balanced reaction).

[Sukhkiran Kaur 3I]

Usually yes, so it would be a good idea to use it unless you know for sure that you're working with a strong acid or base.

[DavidTabib 3H]

When it comes to strong acids and bases, the ICE box method is not really needed. Instead, a ratio is more useful since they fully dissociate.

[Edison Tham 3D]

Strong acid and bases completely dissociate, so finding the [H+] or [OH-] concentration for a strong acid or strong base is fairly simple. For weaker acid and bases, since they do not completely ionize/protonize, we would want to use ICE Box to find the concentrations at equilibrium.

[Javier Perez M 1H]

In terms of test taking, I recommend using the ICE box now in order to become more efficient and avoid errors during exams.

[Jason_John_2F]

you can do it faster if you know that it is strong but doing an icebox every time will work regardless

[SelenaDahabreh1D]

I find ICE boxes to be the best way to determine concentrations, regardless of the strength of the acids. And it is always reliable, so that is a plus!

[Dominic Benna 2E]

I think ICE boxes are especially helpful to use when working with weak acids and bases. However, I think it is just good practice to also use them with strong acids and bases, however, I do not think it is necessary.

[Joanne Yuh 3I]

I agree with what the people said above. For strong bases and acids, we usually don't need to use an ICE box because we are saying that they completely dissociate in water so we can directly use the log calculations. However, for weak acids and bases, we need to use an ICE box because they don't completely dissociate.

[Muskaan Abdul-Sattar]

I believe the ICE box is best used on weak acids and bases! However, you can use it on strong acids and bases as well, it would just be a longer process.

[Sable Summerfield]

Can someone please explain why we need to use an ICE box when molecules don't completely dissociate?

[Jose Miguel Conste 3H]

I would usually use ICE box to make sure all the steps I made were correct, it really is the most correct way to solve things even if there's something easier. I would use it to check your answer sometimes if you're unsure.

[Anthony_Sandoval_1D]

For this class specifically, I would recommend using the ICE box regardless of the strength of the acid or base.

[Arnav Saud 2C]

I think that most of the time ICE boxes are only necessary for weak acids and bases.

[Armen_Isayan_2L]

Hello! Typically, we only use the ICE box method for weak acids and bases because of the nature of the solutions and the amount that will dissociate is difficult to determine. However, we can still use the ICE box method for strong acids and bases, but it is not necessary. Instead, we could use formulas, such as pH, Kb, or Ka which is potentially simpler.

[joshtully]

ICE boxes are usually just used for weak acids and bases.

[Jack_Pearce_2H]

Use an ICE box always for weak acids. Acids will either be strong or weak usually so for strong you can assume 100% ionization, then just use ICE boxes for the weak!

[Sofia Azmat 1I]

I would suggest using the ICE box unless you are certain it is a strong acid/base. They are particularly useful though when you are trying to pinpoint a change in the reaction over time.

[Gustavo_Chavez_1K]

For the ICE method I think we generally just use it for weak bases and acids, and I guess if you are unsure on whether the base or acid is strong then it may be safe to still use the ICE method.