## formula units [ENDORSED]

Natalie_Martinez_1I
Posts: 30
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2018 3:00 am

### formula units

I was looking back at the fundamentals and I kept seeing the phrase "formula units." When a question asks you to find a quantity in terms of formula units does that just mean in terms of atoms?

Ismail 1F
Posts: 32
Joined: Wed Nov 15, 2017 3:02 am

### Re: formula units

Yes, you can use Avogadro's number to convert to formula units.

LilianKhosravi_1H
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Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 10:03 am

### Re: formula units

Yeah I had the same question but I think it just means number of atoms.

Tiffany Tufenkjian 1E
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Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 10:05 am

### Re: formula units

I had this question too, I don't think it will be unclear like this on the test.

Kelly Zhang 1L
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:18 pm

### Re: formula units

Hello hello! I just had a quick question regarding formula units. What is the difference between number of atoms and formula units? For section E's homework 9b, the number of atoms and formula units came out to be different answers.

Saachi_Kotia_4E
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:23 pm

### Re: formula units

The way I understand it is:
formula units can mean atoms or molecules, depending on what the question is asking for. For example, if you need to find the number of formula units in a a certain mass of H2O, you calculate the number of H2O molecules. But if it asks you to find the number of hydrogen atoms in a certain mass of H2O, then you calculate the number of H atoms.

Chem_Mod
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### Re: formula units  [ENDORSED]

See my answers here:

https://lavelle.chem.ucla.edu/forum/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=32772&p=105307&sid=eed5351ba46c7edaa654177d564c3d71&sid=7e485d68778fbf5e6e0db05b8d384ba2#p105307

Formula units apply to salts. Incorrect to refer to NaCl as a molecule or molecular formula.
NaCl is a salt and its formula is referred to as a formula unit.
In this formula unit there are two atoms.

For the salt MgCl2 its formula unit has 3 atoms.

And also read this post:

https://lavelle.chem.ucla.edu/forum/viewtopic.php?f=156&t=32737&sid=7e485d68778fbf5e6e0db05b8d384ba2

Yiwen Chen-3G
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:25 pm

### Re: formula units

Yes I think I have the same problem. Thanks for answers above!

Abby-Hile-1I
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:16 pm

### Re: formula units

I was unsure about what the problems meant by formula units as well, but I just treated it as sort of a synonym for "molecule". So one of the problems asked how many formula units of a compound are in 5.15 g, I just found how many molecules would be in 5.15 g, using Avogadro's number.

Sarah Zhao 4C
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:28 pm

### Re: formula units

Formula units is the equivalent of molecules for different compounds.

Molecules are for molecular compounds. Formula units are for atomic compounds.

Yousif Jafar 1G
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Joined: Thu May 10, 2018 2:00 am

### Re: formula units

Moles are just a measurement kind of like a dozen. You can define what the moles, or dozen, is of so it could be atoms, molecules, formula units, or donuts. The number is the same regardless of what thing its describing.

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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:27 pm

### Re: formula units

Does anybody know what unit "pm" is? I'm doing the homework right now and I'm not sure what it stands for.

Sophia Ding 1B
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:16 pm

### Re: formula units

I think the "pm" you're referring to is the measurement unit of a picometer, which is 10^-12! So to convert that to the unit of a meter which most questions have been using, you would multiply your answer by 10^12.

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A
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### Rounding Up

Hello! I had a question regarding atomic masses. Do we round the atomic masses on the periodic table or leave them as is?

Rosha Mamita 2H
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:19 pm

### Re: formula units

I believe we dont need to round up the atomic masses in the periodic table, the reason being it would make our calculated answers for problems slightly less accurate than the real answers

Zack Barta 3I
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:25 pm

### Re: formula units

Thank you!

305008749
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:27 pm

### Re: formula units

My TA said to not round the atomic masses given on the periodic table, just use them as is. One of the few times that it's safe to round, is when you are trying to find the empirical formula for a compound because that's when you really want the whole numbers.

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A
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### Re: Rounding Up

Thank you for the feedback!

Danny Elias Dis 1E
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:19 pm

### Re: formula units

What was the unit of measurement only used by chemists, also known as 10 to the -10 power?

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:24 pm

### Solution Concentration

How do you know which is the initial molarity, initial volume, final molarity, and/or final volume from a given problem? How do you figure it out?

davidbakalov_lec2_2L
Posts: 52
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:23 pm

### Re: formula units

I believe the unit you are thinking of is the Ãngström, 1Ã = 10^(-10).

BenJohnson1C
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### Re: formula units

From what I understand, "formula units" can be somewhat interchangeable with molecules. For example, how many formula units of H20 are in 2g of water?
the answer would be 6.7x10^22 formula units

Henry Dudley 1G
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:16 pm

### Re: formula units

Sophia Ding 1D wrote:I think the "pm" you're referring to is the measurement unit of a picometer, which is 10^-12! So to convert that to the unit of a meter which most questions have been using, you would multiply your answer by 10^12.

You're right the picometer is 10^-12 and you would multiply by 10^12 to get meters but the question that is being referred to just asks for length meaning the conversion is arbitrary.

Henry Dudley 1G
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:16 pm

### Re: formula units

Danny Elias Dis 1E wrote:What was the unit of measurement only used by chemists, also known as 10 to the -10 power?

The unit that is 10^-10 is the Angstrom which has the symbol Å.

Sapna Ramappa 1J
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### Re: Rounding Up

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A wrote:Hello! I had a question regarding atomic masses. Do we round the atomic masses on the periodic table or leave them as is?

We can calculate everything with the atomic masses given on the periodic table, and then we can round after we consider significant figures at the end of the problem! This will allow us to have more accurate results. :)

Roberto Gonzalez 1L
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:17 pm

### Re: formula units

The "formula units" phrasing throws me off a bit for a question where I am trying to find the "formula units of compound" in a certain amount of grams. Do I just set it up as conversion from grams to moles using molecular weight and solve for the moles of the compound as a whole?

Jordan Lo 2A
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:25 pm

### Re: formula units

I'm also confused about formula units. Are they synonymous with "parts" within a salt? Why and when would a chemist use the word formula unit in place of the word atom?

Chem_Mod wrote:See my answers here:

https://lavelle.chem.ucla.edu/forum/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=32772&p=105307&sid=7e485d68778fbf5e6e0db05b8d384ba2&sid=7be8fc103320c58b2eb3a9da4183dc33#p105307

Formula units apply to salts. Incorrect to refer to NaCl as a molecule or molecular formula.
NaCl is a salt and its formula is referred to as a formula unit.
In this formula unit there are two atoms.

For the salt MgCl2 its formula unit has 3 atoms.

And also read this post:

https://lavelle.chem.ucla.edu/forum/viewtopic.php?f=156&t=32737&sid=7be8fc103320c58b2eb3a9da4183dc33

Dhwani Krishnan 1G
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:17 pm

### Re: formula units

Are salts the only compounds for which you use Formula Units as opposed to Molecule? Or is any compound with 2 different elements a Formula Unit?

Elizabeth Kim 4E
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:29 pm

### Re: formula units

Any ionic or covalent solid compound not just salts

Daniel Bowen 3I
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:24 pm

### Re: Rounding Up

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A wrote:Hello! I had a question regarding atomic masses. Do we round the atomic masses on the periodic table or leave them as is?

I would leave them as is and you can round using significant figures at the end of the problem

Andreana Vetus 1A
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:17 pm

### Re: Solution Concentration

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A wrote:How do you know which is the initial molarity, initial volume, final molarity, and/or final volume from a given problem? How do you figure it out?

These things are stated in the problem, whether it is explicit or implicit. It helps to identify what the numbers mean in the given problem, and record them accordingly as you read. There should only be one of these answers missing, in which you would manipulate the equation M[initial]*V[initial]=M[final]]*V[final].

For example:

What volume of 0.0368 M of KMnO4 is needed to prepare 250ml of 1.50*10^-3 M of KMnO4?

From this we know that we are trying to find a volume of KMnO4. Note that the initial molarity is explicitly stated: 0.0368 M of KMnO4. The final volume we are trying to get is 250ml, which is also explicitly stated. The final molarity is given as 1.50*10^-3 M KMnO4. The missing value is the initial volume. Manipulate the previouslt stated equation to solve for V[initial]. Don't forget to convert mL to L, as Molairty is measured in Liters.

I hope this helps.

Andreana Vetus 1A
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:17 pm

### Re: formula units

I have a simple question regarding basic chemistry:

How can you determine the reactants in a chemical reaction based off of the products?

LG2019
Posts: 37
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:27 pm

### Re: formula units

So is the term 'formula units' only relevant when talking about compounds?

Rami_Z_AbuQubo_2K
Posts: 77
Joined: Thu Jun 07, 2018 2:00 am

### Re: formula units

Wait, so when it is talking about formula units, it does not specifically mean atoms/molecules, right?

Chem_Mod
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### Re: formula units

Formula units and molecules are pretty much the same, except formula units refer to ionic compounds (e.g.NaCl), and molecules refer to molecular compounds.
NaCl is the formula unit for table salt.
One cannot refer to NaCl as a molecular formula because NaCl is not a molecule.

Dina Geotas 4A
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:29 pm

### Re: formula units

Yes I think you just use Avogadro's number to find the number of atoms or molecules!

jillianh1B
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:19 pm

### Re: formula units

This thread is similar to a question I jsut asked. I'm just confused on when to use formula units and when to use other names, like ions, atoms, or molecules? Thanks!

404817859
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Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2017 3:02 am

### Re: formula units

I believe a formula unit is the empirical formula incase that makes it easier to understand

NatBrown1I
Posts: 43
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:17 pm

### Re: formula units

Here's a pretty helpful flowchart I drew the other day to use whenever you try converting from a particular unit to another unit!

In order to get formula units from moles you would multiply by Avogadro's number (6.022 x 10^23) by the number of moles that you have.

Hope this helps.
Attachments

Anusha 1H
Posts: 56
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:15 pm

### Re: formula units

You can use Avogadro's number for atoms, molecules, or formula units.
Formula Units apply to ionic compounds, molecules apply to molecular compounds, and you calculate atoms when in reference to elements.

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A
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Hi, I had a quick question. How do we check how many times we posted on Chemistry Community? Do we go on our profile?

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A
Posts: 35
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:24 pm

### Re: Solution Concentration

Andreana Vetus 1A wrote:
Simran Athwal-Dis 3A wrote:How do you know which is the initial molarity, initial volume, final molarity, and/or final volume from a given problem? How do you figure it out?

These things are stated in the problem, whether it is explicit or implicit. It helps to identify what the numbers mean in the given problem, and record them accordingly as you read. There should only be one of these answers missing, in which you would manipulate the equation M[initial]*V[initial]=M[final]]*V[final].

For example:

What volume of 0.0368 M of KMnO4 is needed to prepare 250ml of 1.50*10^-3 M of KMnO4?

From this we know that we are trying to find a volume of KMnO4. Note that the initial molarity is explicitly stated: 0.0368 M of KMnO4. The final volume we are trying to get is 250ml, which is also explicitly stated. The final molarity is given as 1.50*10^-3 M KMnO4. The missing value is the initial volume. Manipulate the previouslt stated equation to solve for V[initial]. Don't forget to convert mL to L, as Molairty is measured in Liters.

I hope this helps.

Thank you so much. It did help with the example you gave!

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A
Posts: 35
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:24 pm

### Re: Rounding Up

Daniel Bowen 3I wrote:
Simran Athwal-Dis 3A wrote:Hello! I had a question regarding atomic masses. Do we round the atomic masses on the periodic table or leave them as is?

I would leave them as is and you can round using significant figures at the end of the problem

Thank You!

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A
Posts: 35
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:24 pm

### Re: Rounding Up

Sapna Ramappa 3G wrote:We can calculate everything with the atomic masses given on the periodic table, and then we can round after we consider significant figures at the end of the problem! This will allow us to have more accurate results. :)

Thank you so much!

Yvonne Du
Posts: 44
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:23 pm

### Re: Solution Concentration

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A wrote:How do you know which is the initial molarity, initial volume, final molarity, and/or final volume from a given problem? How do you figure it out?

I think most of the questions will state them if not, you can look for hints in the question. For example, if the question is adding water to dilute the molarity, you will know the higher molarity is the initial molarity because dilution means to decrease the molarity.

lukezhang2C
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:18 pm

### Re:

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A wrote:Hi, I had a quick question. How do we check how many times we posted on Chemistry Community? Do we go on our profile?

I think theres an option in profile which shows your posts!

Jessica Dharmawan 1G
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### Re: formula units

I looked at formula units as the number of atoms/molecules, depending on what is given. I used Avogadro's number to find the formula units asked for in the problem.

Arlene Linares 3A
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:25 pm

### Re: formula units

Ismail 1F wrote:Yes, you can use Avogadro's number to convert to formula units.

so that will be the only number we use if it says that?

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A
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### Re: Re:

lukezhang wrote:I think theres an option in profile which shows your posts!

Thank You!

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A
Posts: 35
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:24 pm

### Re: Solution Concentration

Andreana Vetus 1A wrote:These things are stated in the problem, whether it is explicit or implicit. It helps to identify what the numbers mean in the given problem, and record them accordingly as you read. There should only be one of these answers missing, in which you would manipulate the equation M[initial]*V[initial]=M[final]]*V[final].

For example:

What volume of 0.0368 M of KMnO4 is needed to prepare 250ml of 1.50*10^-3 M of KMnO4?

From this we know that we are trying to find a volume of KMnO4. Note that the initial molarity is explicitly stated: 0.0368 M of KMnO4. The final volume we are trying to get is 250ml, which is also explicitly stated. The final molarity is given as 1.50*10^-3 M KMnO4. The missing value is the initial volume. Manipulate the previouslt stated equation to solve for V[initial]. Don't forget to convert mL to L, as Molairty is measured in Liters.

I hope this helps.

Yes, this did indeed help me, especially when you gave the example.

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A
Posts: 35
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:24 pm

### Re: formula units

Hello!
May someone explain more how e- structure give rise to light?

Also, during my lecture I had on Oct. 10th, Dr. Lavelle went over an example using the formula:
Wavelength= hc/E
He included the following:
(6.626 * 10^-34 Js)(3.00 * 10^8 m/s)/3.61 *10^19 J)
Where did he get his numerator is what I am asking?

Hilda Sauceda 3C
Posts: 67
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:24 pm

### Re: formula units

The numbers on the numerator are constants which will always be given and they are found on the "constants and Equations" worksheet.

905096106
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Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2018 11:17 pm

### Re: formula units

Formula Units are the same thing as molecules except for compounds with ionic bonds.

Zack Barta 3I
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:25 pm

### Re: formula units

Thanks!

Jennifer Lathrop 1F
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Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2017 3:00 am

### Re: formula units

Yes, it just means number of atoms which means you use 6.022x10^23

Celine Hoh 2L
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:28 pm

### Re: formula units

Yes, which is the Avogadro Number.

Aria Soeprono 2F
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:27 pm

### Re: Solution Concentration

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A wrote:How do you know which is the initial molarity, initial volume, final molarity, and/or final volume from a given problem? How do you figure it out?

In a problem that involves M1V1=M2V2 you must first identify which you are trying to solve for. If you are solving for final molarity, you know that the molarity the problem gives is the initial molarity. Of the two volumes, the one that comes first is usually the initial volume. If it does not state explicitly what the final volume is, you usually add the amount of water "added" to the solution to the initial volume to get the final volume.

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A
Posts: 35
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:24 pm

### Re: Solution Concentration

AriaSoeprono4I wrote:[quote=In a problem that involves M1V1=M2V2 you must first identify which you are trying to solve for. If you are solving for final molarity, you know that the molarity the problem gives is the initial molarity. Of the two volumes, the one that comes first is usually the initial volume. If it does not state explicitly what the final volume is, you usually add the amount of water "added" to the solution to the initial volume to get the final volume.

Thank you so much!

taywebb
Posts: 39
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:15 pm

### Re: formula units

I was confused about this as well. Thank you so much for the clarification! Does anyone know in what depth we need to know these bonds for the test? (just in terms of specific elements or molecules or even just sketching them out)

Simran Athwal-Dis 3A
Posts: 35
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:24 pm

### Quantum #s?

Hello, I had a quick question. One of the quantum numbers, the one where you have to determine if it is +1/2 or -1/2. How do you figure out if it is +1/2 or -1/2 from only the periodic table? I know how to find the n, l, and ml, but not that specific one. May anyone help to explain?

Arlene Linares 3A
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Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:25 pm

### Re: formula units

For the midterm, does anyone knows how much the units are worth when graded?

Zubair Ahmed 1L
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### Re: formula units

Arlene Linares 3A wrote:For the midterm, does anyone knows how much the units are worth when graded?

I believe both units and sig figs are each worth one point.

Zack Barta 3I
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:25 pm

### Re: formula units

Thanks

Zack Barta 3I
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:25 pm

### Re: formula units

Thanks

Zack Barta 3I
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:25 pm

### Re: formula units

Thanks

Arlene Linares 3A
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:25 pm

### Re: formula units

Zubair Ahmed 1E wrote:
Arlene Linares 3A wrote:For the midterm, does anyone knows how much the units are worth when graded?

I believe both units and sig figs are each worth one point.

Thank you

Danny Elias Dis 1E
Posts: 51
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:19 pm

### Re: formula units

Are degrees (used to describe bond angles) an SI unit?

105002507
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:15 pm

### Re: formula units

no, degrees are not an si unit. Si unit would be a radian

904837647
Posts: 40
Joined: Tue May 01, 2018 2:00 am

### Re: formula units

Are their specific units that we should be using? I usually just follow the units given in the problem, but as I was working through one the answer was given in mL instead of L.